Piano talent - Does it matter for beginners?

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Postby Dr. John Zeigler - PEP Ed » Fri Oct 12, 2007 1:25 pm

Becibu wrote:He wants me to do something in science. He says a career music in any form is useless . I am very good at history and english in school scoring high marks and even so he wants me to do something in science. It doesnt have to be academic it has to be science according to him.

I wouldn't agree that a career in music is "useless." It can be wonderful, but it is very challenging to make a good living in music, unless you're a "superstar." Just read any of our Artist/Educator Interviews. They all pretty much say that you shouldn't plan a career in music unless you can't imagine doing anything else, because it is so difficult.

Since I am a scientist by training and occupation, let me say a couple things about science. Non-scientists usually think that science is all analysis and rationality. While rational analysis is important in science, nothing could be further from the truth to say those are the only important factors in scientific success! The best science is always the most creative and is done by those scientists who can leap beyond logical follow-ons to existing work. It's the also-rans who merely do what they've been taught.

In my area, chemistry, the connection between music and chemistry is so important that the American Chemical Society has done several articles in its journals about the almost "mystical" connection between the two. One of my doctoral professors was an operatic tenor who sang at the Met, but chose chemistry because he could earn a better living to support his growing family. Another was an accomplished violist. Several other chemists are performing pianists.

I'm not suggesting that your father is necessarily "wrong" or "right" in his views. I am simply pointing out that a career in science (if it's something you enjoy) is, in no way, inconsistent with musical talent and interests. :)
All religions, arts and sciences are branches of the same tree. All these aspirations are directed toward ennobling man's life, lifting it from the sphere of mere physical existence and leading the individual towards freedom. - Albert Einstein
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Postby Tranquillo » Fri Oct 12, 2007 9:41 pm

Since I am a scientist by training and occupation, let me say a couple things about science. Non-scientists usually think that science is all analysis and rationality. While rational analysis is important in science, nothing could be further from the truth to say those are the only important factors in scientific success! The best science is always the most creative and is done by those scientists who can leap beyond logical follow-ons to existing work. It's the also-rans who merely do what they've been taught.


You gave me a perspective of something from another angle. See I uad no intention of going into science not because I hate it or am not interested but really because looking beyond that area of being analytical and logical has always been the way I percieve science ,... (especially with the case of school studying chemical reactions sometimes it seemed pointless to conduct the experiement because you know what is going to happen)...

chemistry, the connection between music and chemistry is so important that the American Chemical Society has done several articles in its journals about the almost "mystical" connection between the two.


This is very true in the case of one of the forums with Mozart that music in someway has mysteriously had some profound effect on Austistic ones and the Mozart Effect temporarily increasing ones IQ.
Humans have such a strong link to music it connects with us powerfully not only do we enjoy hearing music and sounds but it can make us feel happy or sad ... it is really a tool and a vehicle of expression!
Dr. Zeigler you have givern me something to think about!

I have read a fare few of those interviews and do agree getting into the industry isnt just what you know its who you know. In school, we have always been told well if you want to do it ... dont exspect to have a 9-5 job, a stable carreer and to work with heaps of money...
Science does astound me and history and music ... they do work with each other ... I thought the study of music therapy would be a 'linkage' to how these work together... Something I would indeed be interested in.

>My father has told me music useless in any field ... (including edcucation) he was reffering to the fact that there are so many sick, dying children in the world (what is music supposed to do) --- That was his thinking. A very rigid thinker mind you.<




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Music is organised sound
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Postby M&m » Sat Oct 13, 2007 8:45 pm

Becibu wrote:I have read a fare few of those interviews and do agree getting into the industry isnt just what you know its who you know. In school, we have always been told well if you want to do it ... dont exspect to have a 9-5 job, a stable carreer and to work with heaps of money...
Science does astound me and history and music ... they do work with each other ... I thought the study of music therapy would be a 'linkage' to how these work together... Something I would indeed be interested in.

>My father has told me music useless in any field ... (including education) he was refering to the fact that there are so many sick, dying children in the world (what is music supposed to do) --- That was his thinking. A very rigid thinker mind you.<

Becibu,

Since so many children on the Autism Spectrum respond to Music ...Music Therapy is very important for that group. Anything to do with Autism since the numbers of diagnosis are growing would be an excellent field to go into. Here is something I found on the
web about Music Therapist:

http://www.ama-assn.org/ama/pub/category/16044.html

Here's another link from the National Association for Music Education:

The Music Therapy that my son went to was with an Early Intervention program.

http://www.menc.org/industry/job/careers/careers.html#mtherapy

My husband works with a guy in Computer Science that also plays for our local Symphony Orchestra.

I think your Dad knows that you have potential and wants you to fulfill it...it is any parents wish. I have another child that is older right now that is not doing that and it breaks my heart.
In the end you have to decide what is right for you.
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Postby Tranquillo » Sun Oct 14, 2007 1:25 am

M&m wrote:I think your Dad knows that you have potential and wants you to fulfill it...it is any parents wish. I have another child that is older right now that is not doing that and it breaks my heart.
In the end you have to decide what is right for you.

... you really think so?
To be honest science is no way one of my strong point subjects ... its really ... English and History ... I am more of a creative/literate that likes to reason and form my own opinuon based on my findings opposed to a logical thinkger.

My dad knows that and still persists that I get into science ... perhaps its due to the fact that he is an engineer.

... Dr. Zeigler mentioned how creativity is important ... Science ... and how music links to science ... I have wanted to get into music therapy ... and as you mentioned it is importatant in regards to Autism ... Because of this I have wanted to get into music therapy ...

I mentioned science and music the other night ... he was like 'that is a whole load of (swear words here)... just stick to medicine' ... Very rigid thinker ... and if he does see my 'poteintal' ... and whats me to fulfil it what I cant understand is why he discourages me and chooses my life path instead of asking me what I like and telling me I have poteintail opposed to having no talent ...
Keep in mind music is something I want to get into not as a performer but maybe as an highschool/private teacher or music therapist. If that does not work out then some sort of a writer (magazines, newspapers, etc) or graphic designer (a job in high demand) ... I have mentioned those careers and he still says History is rubbish ... English isnt going to save life ... science...
"Music is a waste of time" ... M&m ... would you say that when those occasions of saying 'I have no talent' he is really saying ... 'you have poteintail'... maybe you can crack the 'code' of what he is stating.
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Postby M&m » Sun Oct 14, 2007 11:31 am

Becibu wrote:My dad knows that and still persists that I get into science ... perhaps its due to the fact that he is an engineer.

... Dr. Zeigler mentioned how creativity is important ... Science ... and how music links to science ... I have wanted to get into music therapy ... and as you mentioned it is importatant in regards to Autism ... Because of this I have wanted to get into music therapy ...

I mentioned science and music the other night ... he was like 'that is a whole load of (swear words here)... just stick to medicine' ... Very rigid thinker ... and if he does see my 'poteintal' ... and whats me to fulfil it what I cant understand is why he discourages me and chooses my life path instead of asking me what I like and telling me I have poteintail opposed to having no talent ...
Keep in mind music is something I want to get into not as a performer but maybe as an highschool/private teacher or music therapist. If that does not work out then some sort of a writer (magazines, newspapers, etc) or graphic designer (a job in high demand) ... I have mentioned those careers and he still says History is rubbish ... English isnt going to save life ... science...
"Music is a waste of time" ... M&m ... would you say that when those occasions of saying 'I have no talent' he is really saying ... 'you have poteintail'... maybe you can crack the 'code' of what he is stating.

You Dad is an engineer and that explains it all. My dad is also an engineer and very much a perfectionist. What I would do is do my research into Music Therapy and chart out every possible choice. Let your research detail what schooling it will take to become a Music Therapist...what jobs are available, etc.

A good place to start is a link to Wikipedia:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Music_therapy

At the bottom of the page are external links to different associations and what programs are available. The Association for Professional Music Therapist seems like a good link. Your Dad may have a limited view of exactly a Music Therapist really is. You will have to present it in a logical scientific way. He can't argue with cold hard fact.

It might be more that you think it is too.
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